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Guilty Gear -Strive-. Out now!


Kayin Amoh
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I think I did alright here!

 

 

I’ll be honest, I don’t understand half the terms you guys are using but I am winning about 50% of my matches currently. I’ve decided I like Samurai Vampire.

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Update: I am now winning approximately 20% of my matches.

 

what’s the best technique for people who zone you into the side of the stage and relentlessly batter you to a pulp?

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With Nago? Patiently make your way in is probably safest, move forward and block attacks. Super jump your way in is quickest. If you've the blood gauge for it, the clone special into dash (236S then 236K (236 is quarter circle forward in case you're unfamiliar with numpad notation)) can be quite good against projectiles too, but is expensive in blood.

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Yo, Leffen put on a big 10v10 US East vs EU exhibition yesterday, where 4 places in each time were determined by the top 4 placements in the last EU/NA Big Levo tournaments.

 

It's all FT3 matches, everyone plays once, the winning team announces their next player so the losing team can counter pick. Once all 10 initial matches have been played, the survivors then duke it out.

 

You can watch it here:

 

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1104031284?t=00h53m00s

 

I'm just checking it out now. :)

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Whee, I got a reward for grinding the celestial floor!

 

 

Also, a "small aura" for my name, but I cannot find where that has been applied.

 

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I'm going to come right out and say it: GG Strive is my favourite fighting game in a long long time and the most fun I've had with one since Super Street Fighter 4 (When I was Dan trolling exclusively). Maybe even since Soul Calibur.

 

Sure, it might be paired back in terms of options from previous Guilty Gears, but for an intermediate kind of player like me I've got on way better with it in terms of accessibility, and crucially, that accessibility has made me want to learn to get a bit better. It makes higher level play feel like a more achievable goal than something reserved for a select few, without sacrificing so much that those higher level players (with some exceptions) don't call it noob garbage and wander off.

 

There was a video Maximilian Dood did recently where he perfectly summed up the appeal of Strive and why it's such a good fighting game to get into right now for players of all skill levels.

 

The high damage seems to be contentious among the FG community, but I absolutely LOVE it. Soul Calibur (the original) is probably my favourite ever fighting game, and what I liked in that game was combo strings were short, and moves did high damage, so it felt like matches were on a knife edge of timing and opportunity. Strive feels a lot like that. People call Strive a game that is more about "neutral" than before, and I think it's this aspect that appeals to me so much like with Soul Calibur.

 

The pros can argue till the end of time if that it's not as "good" a fighting game as previous Guilty Gear games mechanically, which might be true, but Strive feels completely different to me in a cool way, and I think everything they've done with the game and the way it's drawing in more new players is pretty genius to be honest.

 

Ultimately, I think that's the main success: making lower level players feel at home and enjoy themselves, while still offering a lot of scope for mastery is the kind of balance most games need to keep people coming back, and I think they nailed it. The more people can enjoy games like this and feel encouraged when they learn, the better.

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I mean I spent literally hours on it last night until and even beyond my hands hurting as it's just so much fun to actually play. I haven't been that addicted since, again, probably ssf4.

 

The one more go feeling is obviously helped by both the netcode being some sort of magic, and the floor system meaning you are always fighting people on your skill level somehow. Nearly every match i've had has been very close with very few one sided drubbings. And playing even matched players is what is always most compelling, as you know you both have similar skill "tools", so it will be a matter of how you apply them, rather than your knowledge of combo strings or particular matchups etc, as that is already baked into the floor you're fighting on.

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Incidentally @imp I landed Heavy Mob Cemetery cancelled into NRV then Volcanic Viper last night on an unsuspecting Goldlewis and it felt goooood :lol:

 

Goldlewis Dickedonson.

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1 hour ago, imp said:

Oh, also that exhibition 10v10 is now on youtube, here's the playlist.

 

 

 

Definitely check out Kurokich vs Hotashi. Good christ that is a MATCH.

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13 hours ago, Jonster said:

With Nago? Patiently make your way in is probably safest, move forward and block attacks. Super jump your way in is quickest. If you've the blood gauge for it, the clone special into dash (236S then 236K (236 is quarter circle forward in case you're unfamiliar with numpad notation)) can be quite good against projectiles too, but is expensive in blood.

 

With any character really, I just find that I get boxed in and battered and unable to block or counter. I don’t think Nago has a super jump though (if that’s what a super jump is)

How do number notations work? Shouldn’t they be like numbers on a clock?

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Incidentally I was having a fight against a Milla player last night where I was having very similar problems as in that Sol/Millia fight in that set.  Felt really hard to find a safe opening.

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58 minutes ago, Strafe said:

 

With any character really, I just find that I get boxed in and battered and unable to block or counter. I don’t think Nago has a super jump though (if that’s what a super jump is)

How do number notations work? Shouldn’t they be like numbers on a clock?

 

Numpad notation derives from the numbers on a keyboard. 123 along the bottom, 789 at the top. 5 is when you're not holding any direction. By default these refer to when your character is on the left side of the screen, facing right. A fireball motion from Street Fighter is 236P, for example.

 

Nago has a super jump, he doesn't have an air dash or air jump. You input a super jump by tapping down (in any direction) before jumping.

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1 hour ago, imp said:

 

Numpad notation derives from the numbers on a keyboard. 123 along the bottom, 789 at the top. 5 is when you're not holding any direction. By default these refer to when your character is on the left side of the screen, facing right. A fireball motion from Street Fighter is 236P, for example.

 

Nago has a super jump, he doesn't have an air dash or air jump. You input a super jump by tapping down (in any direction) before jumping.


That makes sense now! Thanks

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17 minutes ago, Benny said:

Kurokich is disgusting.

 

But not gonna lie, I was falling asleep in the Sol mirror match. I like playing Sol, but watching two of them is like the least surprising thing ever. Just two pistons endlessly mashing into each other :lol:

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2 hours ago, Benny said:

 

But not gonna lie, I was falling asleep in the Sol mirror match. I like playing Sol, but watching two of them is like the least surprising thing ever. Just two pistons endlessly mashing into each other :lol:

 

I am of the complete opposite opinion. I HATE playing Sol mirrors, but love watching them. As a character with a 3 frame normal and an invincible reversal, Sol is one of the best equipped characters to deal with his own nonsense. Also, I like watching the RPS during fS pressure -  5K can interrupt fS into fS, but will lost to the fS 5H delayed gatling BIG TIME, so it's always really tense, and amazing when turns get stolen. Plus I enjoy seeing the one-upmanship in terms of combo conversions as Sol's combo routes are so flexible.

 

BTW I played like 15 games against Nyphi7 on Saturday (he must have been warming up for the 10v10 and oh my god he's so good. I did manage to win one game, but he is the most solid, safe player I've fought so far.

 

Spoiler

I was saddened he didn't get more of a chance to shine, but I think he's mainly a PS player, so maybe the PC timings threw him off. I think I saw him missing some run cancel timings, which is a dead giveaway that that's the case.

 

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I did wonder about that actually, are timings more unforgiving on PC, or just a bit different? I'd imagine even a slight difference in milliseconds to response time could throw people off if so.

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Well, the game runs at a 4-5 frame universal delay on PS4 (PS5 is unknown at the moment), but the very fastest PC setups can run with under a 1 frame delay - it just depends on how good your setup is. So the timings can jar a little when you switch from one platform to the other.

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1 hour ago, imp said:

Well, the game runs at a 4-5 frame universal delay on PS4 (PS5 is unknown at the moment), but the very fastest PC setups can run with under a 1 frame delay - it just depends on how good your setup is. So the timings can jar a little when you switch from one platform to the other.

 

I'll blame that whenever I whiff my NRV combo then. Clearly I haven't adapted from the Beta. That's definitely it.

 

Spoiler

I know it's only likely to affect pro play but I'll take what excuses I can get.

 

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5 hours ago, imp said:

 

 

Nago has a super jump, he doesn't have an air dash or air jump. You input a super jump by tapping down (in any direction) before jumping.


I cannot for the life of me do this. I tap down then up for jump? Doesn’t work for me.

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I'm fairly new to the deeper mechanics of Guilty Gear (despite playing the last couple). So why is it that Sol is considered a twat? Is it because he's just easy to play as? Is he cheap?

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1 hour ago, Gambit said:

I'm fairly new to the deeper mechanics of Guilty Gear (despite playing the last couple). So why is it that Sol is considered a twat? Is it because he's just easy to play as? Is he cheap?

 

He just has excellent "normals" with answers to pretty much everything, great damage, good health, strong pressure game, invincible reversals, easily linked combos and specials, and essentially no glaring flaws.

 

There are many strong characters in the game though, and it's more a case that they've definitely designed the game so that most characters already feel "powerful", but because he has a lot of pressure options it makes him feel a bit nastier than others.

 

The actual truth of the matter is while he's top tier, he's not actually broken and not anywhere near the nonsense of other fighting game top tier characters. He's no SF4 Sagat for example. He'll probably get a few balance changes eventually, but you can sort of see why they wanted to make the "main" character very accessible and fun to do well and do lots of damage with, as it's likely to get plenty of people into the game initially, and they can tone him down a bit later.

 

I'm a big fan of characters that feel "powerful" in fighting games though, because it makes the fun factor really high for newer players, and the fact the game still seems very balanced is great. Short matches and high damage keeps momentum and that "just one more go" factor. As soon as characters start getting over tuned or developers listen too much to a player base, characters tend to start losing their unique identity I think.

 

Some of the most popular fighting games ever remained popular precisely because there were some uneven matchups and crazy stuff. So I don't really buy into some of the discourse online that Strive has a Sol problem, he's just currently the top of an overall strong across the board pile.

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3 hours ago, Gambit said:

I'm fairly new to the deeper mechanics of Guilty Gear (despite playing the last couple). So why is it that Sol is considered a twat? Is it because he's just easy to play as? Is he cheap?

 

Sol's privilege vs the rest of the cast comes down to the completeness of his toolset coupled with his huge damage. He is a straight forward character to use with multiple ways to get in against the opponent, has the ability to pressure the opponent in neutral with relative ease, and also strong okizeme*. He's basically the complete package with only the most minor deficiencies you would expect to find in a fighting game character. For example, Ky has incredible neutral and oki tools, but relatively low mid-screen damage to compensate. I would say Sol's most significant weaknesses is his relative predictability in approaching the opponent.

 

Sol is good at all the above because of the following tools:

 

His 3 frame 5K - the fastest normal in the game, tied with Chipp's 5P. It can be used to find gaps in opponents' pressure with far greater ease compared to other characters. It also leads to full combos that deal huge damage from such a fast starting button. This button also works as an anti-air against many opponents' moves. This is significant as it's faster than 6P (the dedicated anti-air button for every character) and leads to much more damaging combos (though the Sol has to commit to these whether or not the 5K connects, making it a bit read-dependant). Still, it's crazy Sol can use this button on reaction, rather than having to spend more mental effort predicting jump-ins like other characters, and gets more reward for doing so. The only downside of this button is that it has long recovery on whiff.

 

Far slash (aka fS) - this button is +2 on block, and has deceptively long range. You will see a lot of Sols bullying opponents by just spamming fS over and over until they get a hit. Although fS into fS CAN be interrupted, the opponent has to be brave in order to do so, as Sol has two options that will beat this - either a delayed gatling into 5H or a frame trap using 5K or 2K, both of which lead to a big combo. Also, the expectation of Sol pressuring using frame traps and strike pressure means he can often use this button to scare the opponent into sitting still, in which case he can run in and throw, leading to a knockdown and oki. Throws are extremely safe in this game as there's a very easy Roman Cancel option select you can perform as long as you have 50 meter to cancel the whiff animation, negating almost 100% of the risk.

 

6S - An excellent mid-range button that has stellar active frames, making it great as a neutral footsies tool, punishing backdashes and pressuring opponents on their wake-up. It's also a great combo starter, especially on counter hit which makes combos very easy to hit confirm into. Although 6S can be punished as it's negative on block, Sol can cancel it into a special to make it (technically) safe; everything that it cancels into is generally punishable. But, by delaying the cancel from 6S to the special, Sol can catch the opponent out, meaning that Sol rarely gets punished for just throwing this move out.

 

Clean hit Volcanic Viper - This requires some setup/skill to execute, but under the correct circumstances, Sol's H volcanic viper can deal extra damage to the opponent and earn him a hard knockdown, leading to an extremely strong oki situation for Sol. It's kind of crazy that clean hit VV does both these things - one would be enough, but both is pretty absurd; see this clip of me fighting a Millia recently:

 

 

 

As Benny says, he's top tier for the moment, but not nearly as bad relative to the rest of the cast compared even to other GG titles. Johnny and Elphelt were many, many times more obnoxious even in the Xrd games - Johnny could skip neutral for 25 meter and set up genuine unblockables which led to stupidly high damage, and Elphelt could combo into knockdown from almost any hit, forcing a weighted game of RPS every time, as well as being able to do absurd frame trap pressure with her shotgun and grenade nonsense. And going back to XX, Testament, Zappa and to a slightly lesser extent Eddie were all so obnoxious at filling the screen up with crap and locking the opponent down that the game basically became 1 player...

 

Anyway, it'll be interesting to see how Sol ends up in the long run as a fairly simple but powerful character. He's obviously strong at the minute, but these types of characters only tend to do well for so long in fighting games. I have a feeling characters with more potential for grimy setplay like Chipp and Ram will become more dominant in the long term. Not that we're really seeing many Sols actually win tournaments; though they're always placing very highly.

 

 

*Also known as "oki" - this is the art of pressuring you opponent as they rise from a move that has knocked them down.

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