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Destiny 2: still no word from Eris

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The only bit that really concerns me in there is the changes to the Nightfall, removing the timed elements and moving to *undefined*. Otherwise, if they get those changes right, D2 could end up in a nice place in 9 months. We'll see, I guess.

 

It's sad they're basically admitting they're so far off base that they're just going to do everything reddit asked, I think, but raid perks, better mods, changes to slots could all add up to a better game.

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I never played d1 but most of this sounds like stuff that should have been on the game at launch. Is this an early access game or something? Text chat and team members showing up on the map? 

 

They should be getting all of this stuff out ASAP. Not "fall 2018".

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7 hours ago, Mr Ben said:

News blog is up - https://www.bungie.net/en/Explore/Detail/News/46567

 

Lots here, so spoilered for length

  Reveal hidden contents

Eververse

We recognize that the scales are tipped too far towards Tess at the moment, and Eververse was never intended to be a substitute for end game content and rewards. So, we’ll be making three changes for upcoming Seasons:

We’re shifting the balance of new content in favor of activity rewards over Bright Engrams. This includes adding Ghosts, Sparrows, and ships (to date found only in Bright Engrams) to achievement reward pools.

We'll provide a gameplay path to earn Bright Engrams and all contained rewards (including Event Engrams).

We’ll give players more direct purchase options and make adjustments to Bright Engrams to allow players to get the items they want more often.

We’ve begun implementing these changes for the Crimson Days event beginning February 13 (with even more changes on the way in Season 3): 

Completing Nightfall, Raid, and Crimson Days milestones during Crimson Days will reward you an exclusive Legendary Emote, Weapon Skin, and Exotic Sparrow, respectively.

Players will earn double engrams at level-up: one Crimson Engram and one Illuminated Engram for the duration of the event.

Crimson Engrams can also drop from completing the Crimson Days match and from completing the Crimson Days milestone on each character.

Each Crimson Engram is very strongly weighted to new rewards when decrypted until all new event items have been obtained.

 XP Rates

We are still investigating changes to XP earn rates. Our goal with any updates to XP are transparency and consistent XP gain regardless of your preferred activity. Right now, it’s too slow in general and lopsided towards grinding specific activities (which is not a fun grind) and we want to fix that without making those activities low value to players who aren’t grinding them (fairness is cool). Our first attempt turned out to be unworkably buggy so we’re having to investigate other angles. We will continue to update you as we move forward.

Feature Roadmap

There are three releases that we want to put on your radar right now. Later releases will get more specific dates as they get closer.

The following content and features will be available to all D2 players, regardless of expansion ownership.

January 30 Update

Masterwork Armor

We are expanding the Masterwork system to include armor. 

Masterwork Armor provides increased damage reduction while using your Super. 

You can reroll the armor stat type on Masterwork Armor, and similar to Masterwork weapons, you can upgrade a piece of armor to Masterwork by spending Masterwork Cores and Legendary Shards.

 Raid Reward Rework

We are updating Raid rewards to make them more unique and interesting. They will now feature mods with Raid-specific perks, and we are adjusting the rewards to ensure a Raid item drops from each major encounter. The Raid vendor will also directly sell Leviathan and Eater of Worlds armor and weapons for purchase with Raid tokens and Legendary Shards.

We are also adding a new Ghost with Raid-specific perks that has a chance to drop from the Leviathan and Eater of Worlds final encounters. We intend to return to creating more Raid and other activity-unique rewards in the future.

February Update

Strike Scoring + High Score Tracking

Strike Scoring is coming to Nightfall and replacing the current time limit mechanic. The scoring is similar to the Destiny 1 system but with adjustments to emphasize competitive execution of Strike objectives and support for player selectable score modifiers. In February, Nightfall High Scores will be exposed in-game via new emblems and will unlock rewards. We also have plans for Clan and Community High Scores in the works.

Mods 2.0

Work is underway on a full rework of armor and weapon mods. This will focus on reducing redundant mods, more unique theming, and greatly increasing their impact on your power. We are aiming for a February release, but the scope of the rework could push parts or all of it out to early spring. We will be evaluating how Mods play into the Bright Engram economy as a result, because we’re sensitive to pay-to-win outcomes.

Quickplay Improvements

We are adjusting game mode rules to increase the pace of gameplay and power ammo acquisition in Quickplay.

PC Tower Chat

We are adding text chat to the Tower for the PC version of the game.

Exotic Repetition Reduction

This will prevent players from receiving the same Exotic twice in a row. You may still receive duplicates, just not consecutively.

Fireteam Members on Destination Map

You will finally be able to see the other members of your fireteam on the destination map. No more having to ask your fireteam where they went when they fast travel to another landing zone.

Spring 2018

We’re taking the time we need in development of Expansion 2 that will allow us to react to player feedback from Curse of Osiris. In the coming months, we’ll talk to you more about what you can expect to find in Destiny 2’s next story. The team is eager to show you what they’ve been working on.

Independent of Expansion 2, the team will deliver a number of new features that will be released before or during Season 3. Every player of Destiny 2 will receive new content in the following categories…
 
Crucible

We want to give players new reasons to play, more variety, and balance improvements. Spring will bring a number of exciting and long awaited features to the Crucible.

Beginning with Season 3 we will introduce Seasonal Crucible Ranks. There will be two different ranks for players to pursue:

Valor – A progression rank that goes up as you complete matches. Winning helps you move up faster, but there are no loss penalties.

Glory – A progression rank that goes up when you win and down when you lose. Performance is how you move up here.

Private Matches are coming to all players of Destiny 2. Players will be able to invite their friends to play on the map and mode of their choosing.

6v6 Playlist

We’re bringing 6v6 PvP to Destiny 2 in addition to the current 4v4 game modes.

Mayhem Event

Mayhem will return as a limited-time event during Season 3 and going forward.

We are making some changes to make quitting less common and behind-the-scenes security improvements to help improve the overall Crucible experience.
 
Additional Highlights

Weapon and Ability Balance Pass

Sandbox adjustments based on player feedback and data from the live game. The Sandbox team will share specific changes as we lead up to Season 3.

Exotic Weapon and Armor Balance Pass

Exotic weapons and armor are receiving a comprehensive design pass to ensure they stand out from the rest of the gear and offer new, exciting, powerful ways to play.

Seasonal Reputation

Specific vendors will now display a Seasonal ranking. Earning reputation will unlock unique Seasonal rewards and will reset each Season.

Improved Iron Banner and Faction Rallies

In addition to the changes that you will see when Iron Banner and Faction Rallies return this month, we will continue iterating on these to make them unique, exciting experiences that you all look forward to.

Playlist Repetition Reduction

This feature solves the problem of experiencing the same playlist entry multiple times in consecutive or frequent succession for both Crucible and Strikes.

End Game Player Pursuits

We agree with your feedback on the imbalance between Achievement and Bright Engram rewards, and we will be making adjustments to shift more rewards into specific endgame pursuits instead of generic XP grinding for Bright Engrams. We are excited to share the details as soon as we have them worked out.

Multi-Emote

When multi-emote launches, you will be able to choose which emote you have equipped to each of your four emote slots.

Vault space

We are targeting an additional 50 slots to player vaults. We don’t believe just adding more space is a complete solution and are actively working on other changes to reduce load on your vault space.

We are adding an Exotic accessory tab to Vault collections so you will no longer need to spend Vault space on Exotic Ships, Sparrows, and Ghosts.

PC Clan Chat

In addition to the Tower chat that is targeted for February, we are adding clan chat to the PC version of the game.

Heroic Strike Changes

We’ll be introducing modifiers to add more gameplay variety to the experience.

Fall 2018 (or sooner)

We are working on a lot more that we're not quite ready to discuss. Expect more on this small sample of items in the future:

Item Collections and Records

Weapon Slot and Archetype Improvements

Additional Crucible Playlists (e.g. Rumble)

Better Clan Rewards

Masterwork Exotics

Pinnacle Weapon and Gear Improvements

Trials of the Nine improvements

Shaders and dismantling

The Future of Guided Games

Address Solo Vs Fireteam matching

 

 One Final Note

Expect to hear more from us via Bungie.net, Twitch, and social media. We’ll be talking to you more directly, and more often, as promised. We want to thank our community for all the passionate and detailed feedback you provide. It’s critical to our ability to continually improve Destiny, so thank you!

Edit: cleaned up formatting, and removed redundant headers, etc.

 

TL/DR; Play something else for 12 months

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I sort of don't know what people were possibly expecting. I'm surprised they've got as much coming as quickly as they have, and appreciate the clarity on what's coming later. If they really are changing the second expansion based on all the problems then I'm honestly quite impressed. Yes, the bulk of this is Destiny 1 thinking, and you can argue it should have been in there at launch. But at least they're doing it now, right?

 

As for DeeJ bigging up the weekly non-update, I suspect (and hope) he's trying to justify his continued existence. The best thing about the Barratt update is the plain language – it's not this pompous, in-universe thing, and it's been the case for ages that Bungie needs to stop pretending that it's another NPC in the tower and get devs talking directly to players in their own language. If this is the way forward, what's the point of DeeJ? Fingers crossed anyway. Unfortunately he's got friends in high places so won't be an easy fire, but I hold out hope. 

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33 minutes ago, Uncle Mike said:

 

 

It's sad they're basically admitting they're so far off base that they're just going to do everything reddit asked, 

 

That's a bit disingenuous isn't it? It's stuff that should be expected after what happened with the previous game, not some nebulous list of demands from a group of tantrum throwing children. It's like your house burned down because you left the gas cooker on. Instead of learning from that and either being ultra careful in future or even changing to electric, they've doubled down and put open flame BBQ pits in every room. 

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It's spell on me is now broken. As I've already paid for it I expect I'll whizz through the second spring expansion but the chances of me picking up the big Expansion whenever it lands at launch are pretty much zero. I'll wait until I've seen the reception it gets and, even then, until it's on sale.

 

Not played D2 since the start of the Christmas holidays. Done 90 hours across 2 characters so happy with that. The boy has lost interest as well now, so it's all Fortnite for him and my backlog for me in our house. 

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6 minutes ago, Scruff said:

That's a bit disingenuous isn't it? It's stuff that should be expected after what happened with the previous game, not some nebulous list of demands from a group of tantrum throwing children.

 

I don't mean to suggest that I think reddit were wrong. It's just I get the sense from their updates that actually Bungie don't have ideas of their own here. It's like they've made all these changes to systems and setup for D2 with this narrow focus on one area ("balance") and not thought it through. And they're so far down the rabbit hole, it's left them without a clear vision. In place of that, they're just going to implement reddit's wishlist.

 

That's perhaps not a bad thing (and I share Nate's sentiment that I'm broadly positive about the update. It was more concrete and wide-reaching than I expected) but I walk away from it a little disappointed in Bungie that they don't have D2 ideas of their own.

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Whatever happened to balancing Prometheus lens? That was the only thing I really wanted from this update. Bungie really fucked this one up. Well done you cock suckers. Expect some death threats on twitter.:D

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They did have ideas, they just really badly failed. I don't think it's quite so simple as giving reddit what they're asking for – rather it's about both of them reaching the same sets of conclusions on what's needed. 

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Yeah, that's a pretty reasonable position to take. I wasn't being aggressive, I'm just so fucked off with them that where you see lack of direction and hesitation in them, I see pettiness and arrogance. To me, they don't care what the players believe should be in the game, they know best and we'd best like it.

 

I mean, they can say 'oh, we know things aren't balanced with Eververse' but that's a blatant lie and lip service, the same as the XP debacle. If it wasn't for enterprising redditors we'd all still be none the wiser and Bungie would be trying it on even more. They're a shithouse bunch of cunts and we'll pay for having the impunity to question them in some way or another.

 

*edit - to Mike

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I think having 6v6 as another option is a really good solution. As opposed to replacing the 4v4 modes. I wish there were 4 player versions of the raid content. Are weapon skins a thing now? 

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40 minutes ago, Weavus said:

 

TL/DR; Play something else for 12 months

Essentially Reddits reaction to it in a nutshell, or wait for D3, if you are so inclined (which is probably no-one right now!).

 

I know I didnt post any reactions to it all, but thats because I knew not to expect much, and I am surprised to see the list is fairly long, but their priorities on the time scale of things is way out of wack. For example, a lot of the stuff in the Fall 2018 part should be right now - Shaders, and how to mass delete them, storage space for them (kiosk?) and why they take up so much room in the first place, Item Collections and Records - its there for exotics, it just costs 10 shards, why not just copy that for other stuff? We have to wait that long for Rumble and other Crucible game modes as well? Seriously?!?

 

Almost all of the first 2 months is what we were expecting anyway, as they announced it all (Eververse stuff aside) before they buggered off for Xmas, so nothing new there. The Eververse thing is obviously due to the reaction the playerbase has had over the past 2 months or so. And rightly bloody so! The new proposed system is how it should have been from the start, oddly enough like it was in Destiny 1.

 

Obviously that factors into endgame rewards, and of course the lore will now be free from the Eververse, finally, so a score for the lore boffins. I guess. Obviously we dont know where these rewards will be placed, but a ghost in the raid (each raid?) is a start. I am worried a little about the "raid specific" perks however, mainly because of weapons being altered to only be effective in the raids, rather than as they are now. I hope they mean that they will gain an additional effect in the raid, rather than changing an existing perk or whatever.

 

My main gripe is that they should be looking at the core systems sooner rather than later, as if they decide to change, say the weapon system, that will throw a lot of other things out of wack the longer they leave it. That is of course, if they are even thinking of looking at the core weapon system. Lord knows they should, as snipers, shotguns and fusion rifles are in a bad place right now, and have been since launch!

 

To sum up, I think there are a lot of good changes here, but they are a bit muddled as to their priorities. I have to say though, that with 700+ people working at Bungie, its a bit rubbish that it will take that long to fix all this. I suspect that they have the majority of those working on D3, or whatever next project is in the works (we know they have one, it was in that BBC documentary), and wont pull them off that to fix Destiny 2. Which is a shame, as fixing this should really be their highest priority, as I dont think many people are that interested in whats next from Bungie anymore.

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Looks like rebalancing weapons will continue to be a season by season thing from my read. But maybe they'll play around with heavy spawns before then?

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10 minutes ago, Nate Dogg III said:

I don't think it's quite so simple as giving reddit what they're asking for – rather it's about both of them reaching the same sets of conclusions on what's needed. 

 

I hope so. Otherwise I'm quite worried about later down the road!

 

The overall reaction to this around the net is a practically perfect case study for anyone doing perception management/PR/crisis response. Once you've lost trust, it's a hard slog to get it back.

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9 minutes ago, Uncle Mike said:

 

I hope so. Otherwise I'm quite worried about later down the road!

 

The overall reaction to this around the net is a practically perfect case study for anyone doing perception management/PR/crisis response. Once you've lost trust, it's a hard slog to get it back.

 

Yes absolutely. One of the early comments in the reddit megathread last night was something like, "I'll be back in a few hours when everyone's upvoted the post that tells me what to think about this" and while I'm sure it was meant at least partially in jest, it was so, so instructive. That's the problem in a nutshell.

 

I'm looking forward to Datto's video on it. He was asked to sum up his initial reaction in one word and went with "whelmed", which makes a lot of sense. It's good stuff, but good stuff that should never have been taken away from us, and in some cases is taking a little too long to be given back. I don't think anyone's upset about what's in the post itself, really, they're just sad – and in many cases angry – that it was even necessary. 

 

 

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I found it telling when both Datto and Ms 5000 Watts (who's husband works at Bungie.....awkward!) both decided to play other games on their Twitch streams and Youtube accounts more than Destiny from now on. That was before this update. Felt a bit like they had inside info, which with Ms 5000 Watts, may have been the case :lol:

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They're all at it. Datto said last year that 2018 was looking rough for anyone trying to do pure Destiny and he was likely to branch out. I feel for those guys – QoL changes benefit players, not streamers. They need content for that.

 

On the bright side it's got me watching Fortnite, and thinking about giving it a go. Kraftyy's predictably amazing at it.

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10 minutes ago, Nate Dogg III said:

On the bright side it's got me watching Fortnite, and thinking about giving it a go.

 

I suggested that ages ago. :quote: ;)

 

If you are interested then there's a bunch of PS4 peeps playing most nights, most playing instead of Destiny nowadays.

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Been playing all my back catalogue of games instead, and theres quite a lot.

 

I have tried Warframe, and while its incredibly deep with its mods, character customisation, and character growth, its also too deep at the start, in that it throws you into the deep end, the story takes far too long to get started - I still have no idea what I'm supposed to be doing after like 60 hours or whatever (thats only an estimate, as I havent looked at time played) - and you feel that after that long you still havent scratched the surface. Its clearly supposed to be an actual MMO, and is ridiculously complex. Might go back to it, if only to figure out wtf is going on in it.

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5 minutes ago, Harsin said:

 

I suggested that ages ago. :quote: ;)

 

If you are interested then there's a bunch of PS4 peeps playing most nights, most playing instead of Destiny nowadays.

 

Yeah I know. I think that, as with PUBG, it's something I'd prefer to watch than play. Would be too worried about letting the side down. Also the whole building thing just spins me out a bit.

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Quote

"We will be evaluating how Mods play into the Bright Engram economy as a result, because we’re sensitive to pay-to-win outcomes."

 

Just don't put them into BEs then.

Problem solved.


I should be a game designer

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2 hours ago, Uncle Mike said:

It's just I get the sense from their updates that actually Bungie don't have ideas of their own here. It's like they've made all these changes to systems and setup for D2 with this narrow focus on one area ("balance Eververse") and not thought it through. 

 

Fixed that for you.

 

"we’re sensitive to pay-to-win outcomes." is the reason the loot feels so bland and weak. Can't be having powerful loot in bright engrams as it may be deemed pay-to-win, but can't have loot in the game thats more powerful than it outside of bright engrams or nobody will buy silver. If you can't make powerful loot outside of bright engrams why make a black spindle type quest as nobody will be bother to do it. Can't have random rolls in loot in bright engrams or thats pay-to-win so can't have random rolls outside of bright engrams or nobody will buy silver. It affects everything.

 

Eververse is the single reason D2 was such a turd on delivery. The only change they need to make right now is to go back to making it emotes only. Everything else will correct itself over time after that as they will no longer have to think how it affects their cash cow.

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Gamers are such an entitled bunch of fucking shitheads.

 

Microsoft absolutely fucked the XBOX One based on "feedback" from a community that all then went out and bought PS4s anyway.

 

Bungie just list out every fucking thing they have been told to do and the reaction is "no fuck u".

 

Maybe if you don't want the game you should just fuck off and stop talking about it so that these companies aren't hearing "feedback" from fickle children who have already moved onto the next thing.

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We wanted the game to build on all the improvements they’d made throughout D1. At the end of D1 you’d for me near enough the perfect game. 

 

With D2 we were hoping for what we had already in regards to gameplay and rewards perhaps refined and a whole new world to play that in. What we got was a a big step backwards in regards to the endgame. Early to mid they knocked it out of the park, endgame they blew. 

 

That can be seen from LFG’s etc, in D1 throughout you never had problems getting a raid or even nightfall together.  4 months into D2 it’s a ghost town. 

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4 minutes ago, mikeyl said:

Who are the misfits who asked for the Nightfall timer to be taken away though? Nightfalls are supposed to be rock.

 

Just needed a much bigger more diverse set of random modifiers imo (hey, like D1!). The timer concept was great although the timegates and oracles were a bit rubbish after the first go as they were always in the same place. They should have randomised those too. 

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46 minutes ago, DonRumsfeld said:

We wanted the game to build on all the improvements they’d made throughout D1. At the end of D1 you’d for me near enough the perfect game. 

 

With D2 we were hoping for what we had already in regards to gameplay and rewards perhaps refined and a whole new world to play that in. What we got was a a big step backwards in regards to the endgame. Early to mid they knocked it out of the park, endgame they blew. 

 

That can be seen from LFG’s etc, in D1 throughout you never had problems getting a raid or even nightfall together.  4 months into D2 it’s a ghost town. 

 

I completely understand that, although tbh I stopped playing D1 somewhere around the time of the last expansion.

 

It's not like I don't share the frustrations - what I don't understand is why people have to ruin it for those of us who are still playing when they clearly won't be happy with any realistic outcome. Why would people spend all of their time on reddit posting about a game they don't play, asking for improvements to it, to then meet an announcement about those improvements with "I'm not coming back".

 

For the average punter its an £80 investment, I get that, but the same people have piles of games they have never played, or are happy to spend £80 on the next thing to play while moaning about this one. For Bungie, for the people working on this it's not only their work, their art, it's their future livelyhood and I just think people should have some more respect for that and be a bit more mindful about how they spend their time.

 

 

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2 hours ago, Nate Dogg III said:

 

Yeah I know. I think that, as with PUBG, it's something I'd prefer to watch than play. Would be too worried about letting the side down. Also the whole building thing just spins me out a bit.

 

There’s solo modes in both that are great where nobody else is relying on you.

 

1 hour ago, Gaz said:

Microsoft absolutely fucked the XBOX One based on "feedback" from a community that all then went out and bought PS4s anyway.

 

Literally nobody asked for the DRM filled TV box, Microsoft created that to please their shareholders, not their customers.

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