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Gender Diversity / Politics in games (was Tropes Vs. Women)

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The current CEO of Failbetter Games where Alexis Kennedy used to be CEO has written in a personal capacity in response to Alexis' statement

 

https://medium.com/@wastebooks/alexis-kennedy-71044efc0ecf

 

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Alexis has now responded in a post he called ‘What Actually Happened’. It is not an accurate title. 

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I’ve seen various suggestions that these matters should not have been raised publicly; that they should have been taken up with the individual, with a HR department, with the police, with the courts.

 

I can’t speak for others, but I’m talking about this because I want to work in an industry where:

- Newcomers of any gender can safely seek out sources of mentorship and guidance;

 

- People who’ve been harmed feel safe and welcome at our events;

 

- The standards of acceptable behaviour are higher than ‘has not committed a criminal offence’.

 

Right now, I can’t see an adequate alternative to public discussion. I’ll talk later about my own past attempt to address one part of this with Alexis privately. It wasn’t successful; had I or others tried again, I don’t believe it would have gone better.

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his version of the story is inaccurate and omits important details

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Alexis has an explanation for why so many people in the industry have believed the allegations. He says they were primed by a bunch of unfounded rumours in an echo chamber, perhaps spread by a single person. That isn’t true.

First, quite a few people have made it clear that their belief is founded on their own personal experiences with Alexis, or those of their direct acquaintances.

 

Second, not everything heard from others is a rumour. We all make use of information shared with us by others, and learn ways to assess its reliability. Personally, I have heard few rumours about Alexis. I have heard a lot of detailed and specific allegations. At this time, only a fraction of them have made their way onto the public internet. They aren’t mine to share. However, I’ll talk later about an experience I had with Alexis that I think illustrates the behaviour of which he has been accused, and which might help anyone who needs to form an opinion on this to do so.

 

Third, it’s a small industry. Many of us are acquainted with Alexis’s principal accusers, who put their own reputations on the line by speaking out. We have informed opinions about their integrity, judgement, access to information and evidential standards.

 

tl;dr: Alexis Kennedy is a lying abusive arsehole

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Just read the above piece, it's a pretty convincing rebuttal. The article he links to is gret as well.

 

https://theweek.com/articles/737056/myth-male-bumbler

 



There's a reason for this plague of know-nothings: The bumbler's perpetual amazement exonerates him. Incompetence is less damaging than malice. And men — particularly powerful men — use that loophole like corporations use off-shore accounts. The bumbler takes one of our culture's most muscular myths — that men are clueless — and weaponizes it into an alibi.

Allow me to make a controversial proposition: Men are every bit as sneaky and calculating and venomous as women are widely suspected to be. And the bumbler — the very figure that shelters them from this ugly truth — is the best and hardest proof.

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I kind of miss Anita's Trope series, it would be nice to see examples of how current games get things wrong as a collective rather than what you get now (typically an article about a single game)

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On 28/09/2019 at 21:12, Capwn said:

I kind of miss Anita's Trope series, it would be nice to see examples of how current games get things wrong as a collective rather than what you get now (typically an article about a single game)

 

I was thinking about this just the other day while looking up opinions and reviews on Nier Automata a couple of weeks back. IN one place (a traditionally non-videogame forum) some posts from 2017 pointed out that one of the victories of GG was that weird or problematic issues with games were no longer open to debate in video games press. Which is a shame because I would have loved to have read some debate over the costume design for 2B.

 

Recent reviews of works like Code Vein seem to have taken pains to skirt around some issues apart from RPS who started their review with

Code Vein is a sexist action RPG about post-apocalyptic vampires that borrows liberally from Dark Souls, while speeding up and complicating its combat in ways that I really like. The plot’s a bit rubbish.



*Dusts hands*.

 

 

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Given how popular those Trope videos were and how much attention they received I'm surprised nobody else has attempted to make a similar youtube series?

 

Then again, after all the death threats and abuse Anita received it could be pretty scary for anyone to even attempt to take her baton and continue running with it. 

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16 hours ago, Capwn said:

Given how popular those Trope videos were and how much attention they received I'm surprised nobody else has attempted to make a similar youtube series?

 

Then again, after all the death threats and abuse Anita received it could be pretty scary for anyone to even attempt to take her baton and continue running with it. 

Yeah I think most people want to stay the fuck away from them so they don't get attacked and doxxed etc. In a way he scumbags have won.

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On 01/09/2019 at 07:38, Broker said:

 

Being dead doesn’t stop you being a fucking scumbag, see Totalbiscuit. Pathetic, right wing, sexist cunts are desperate to turn all the dead sexist cunts into martyrs for people like you to rally around, people whose disgusting opinions you can trot out forever when you’re being nasty little bigots because you’re genuinely stupid enough to think that if someone is dead none of their repulsive ideas are up for discussion. But guess what? A dead racist, or a dead sexist, or a dead sexual abuser, is still a fucking cunt. Just like you are and will always be, no matter how hard you try to pretend you’re just misunderstanding so you can keep trolling the people on here stupid enough to be trying to educate you out of your endless, hateful bigotry. 

 

You've responded exactly how I expected you might. You are fueled with hate and bile with absolutely anything that isn't you, which I'd normally find sad, except your schoolyard bully attitude deserves no pity and thankfully, is being called out by others on the forum as well.

It is a absolutely hilarious you mention me and hate in the same line when compared to yourself.

 

To the dev poster here who cut ties with the dead dev, only to be told here they shouldn't feel guilty (couldn't be arsed to quote), is sadly just as inhumane/unemotional an action to be told. He died because within a week cancel culture cut ties with him, no judge, no jury. The very 'very' least you can manage is indeed, guilt. Guilt for beleving anything on face value and acting on it.

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59 minutes ago, NEG said:

 

You've responded exactly how I expected you might. You are fueled with hate and bile with absolutely anything that isn't you, which I'd normally find sad, except your schoolyard bully attitude deserves no pity and thankfully, is being called out by others on the forum as well.

It is a absolutely hilarious you mention me and hate in the same line when compared to yourself.

 

To the dev poster here who cut ties with the dead dev, only to be told here they shouldn't feel guilty (couldn't be arsed to quote), is sadly just as inhumane/unemotional an action to be told. He died because within a week cancel culture cut ties with him, no judge, no jury. The very 'very' least you can manage is indeed, guilt. Guilt for beleving anything on face value and acting on it.

 

Yeah fuck you mate.

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2 hours ago, NEG said:

 

You've....

 

I'm going to stop you right there and spare quoting the rest. I know you've been away for a bit but maybe before posting read the past few pages and ruminate for a bit before posting a response. There's a fair bit of nuanced debate (and to be fair some trash) to read through because the whole situation is far from the black or white conclusion you seem to have come to.

 

As for responding to Broker's post from a month ago you can report the post. If you want to discuss your moderation rather than debate it here you can chat about it here 

https://www.rllmukforum.com/index.php?/topic/310145-politics-threads-moddingnot-modding/

 

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5 hours ago, SweatyTravolta said:

Not when combined with the their tweets, utterly disgusting shitebags.

Aah, I didn't know the whole story was just going off the text in that article. 

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That discount is a stretch, not least because in the EU it rounds to 42%. It's just the compound of 2 individual discounts.

 

Doesn't make the devs any less scum of course but that's not why.

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The FBI released some more files on Gamergate (following the previous batch they released in 2017).

 

https://vault.fbi.gov/gamergate-1/gamergate-part-01-of-01/view

 

Most of it's redacted, but it contains reports from people doxxed by 8chan's /baphomet/, as well as reports from Gamergaters complaining about Gamergate things.

 

I think the complaints on pages 83 and 87 refer to FoldableHuman's since-deleted Medium article "The Mods are Always Asleep" about the prevalence of child porn on 8chan. Because it contained blurred screenshots, Gamergaters claimed that anyone viewing or linking to it was also in possession of child porn.

 

Highlights via Reddit:

 

XSx1SWY.png

 

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P.s. love your work

 

 

yEBXLLy.png

 

Curse you, Anita, for not fulfilling your crowdfunding obligations! :mad:

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On 02/10/2019 at 10:27, NEG said:

To the dev poster here who cut ties with the dead dev, only to be told here they shouldn't feel guilty (couldn't be arsed to quote), is sadly just as inhumane/unemotional an action to be told. He died because within a week cancel culture cut ties with him, no judge, no jury. The very 'very' least you can manage is indeed, guilt. Guilt for beleving anything on face value and acting on it.

 

Seems I was banned for 3 months for saying this. The ban notes by @APM which the forum cannot see stated that I attacked/blamed the dev poster, which we'll just have to agree to disagree. It was not meant to come off as an attack, and in fact they were not even spoken to directly. I was telling off the guy who told the dev to basically not feel anything. That, to me, is wrong.

This is the kind of thing that affects us all as gamers and devs of the hobby alike, it is normal to feel guilt and shitty about a situation, no matter your stance on it or level of involvement. It is worse to tell someone not to feel, especially someone that appears to have known him to some degree. We all let our hobby down when shit like this happens, no one deserves topping themselves via media backlash. No one.

 

If defending my stance is a ban offence, perhaps the forum feels like we should have felt good and celebrated that the developer of Night in the Woods and Aquaria is gone (both great games) instead of any other emotions, then feel free. I do not feel I was in the wrong here for pointing out feelings, including negative ones like guilt, are okay to have. The only thing I could have added was 'by all'.

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That's not what happened. You got banned for being a dickhead and all of your misogynistic stuff. 

 

This is what happened regarding Night in the Woods-

 

https://medium.com/@bombsfall/alec-2618dc1e23e

 

It's a heartbreaking story for everyone involved. It's still okay to play and enjoy Night in the Woods. Nothing like what you keep going on about. 

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3 hours ago, memories said:

 

Interesting stuff. Has anyone tried to do any research into misogynistic attitudes among gamers, and whether this supposedly anti-social hobby (as we all know, it absolutely doesn't have to be) particularly attracts misogynists? Are movie-goers just as bad? What about fans of other things? It would be interesting to find out whether gaming in particular is a black spot here, or whether the problems in the industry are the same in pretty much any allegedly male-dominated hobby. I don't think I'm wording this post particularly well, but I'm wondering whether people who have issues with women for various reasons are more attracted to gaming than other pursuits partly because it's a way of finding and feeling like a community when IRL they're less able to do so. And do the actions of many devs/publishers in not outright condemning Gamergate feed into these problems?

 

So yeah, are there any studies into misogyny among gamers? And if not, why not? We have a pretty progressive gaming community on rllmuk in the main, but looking at posts on Reddit/YouTube/Twitter etc, we're an oasis in a world of shit when it comes to this stuff. Or is the problem not who gaming can attract, but just men as a whole, really?

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11 hours ago, LeighCb said:

That's not what happened. You got banned for being a dickhead and all of your misogynistic stuff. 

 

You are incorrect, but thanks for the delightfully worded input.

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59 minutes ago, NEG said:

 

You are incorrect, but thanks for the delightfully worded input.

Used your ban time for some important self reflection then? 

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8 hours ago, Eighthours said:

 

Interesting stuff. Has anyone tried to do any research into misogynistic attitudes among gamers, and whether this supposedly anti-social hobby (as we all know, it absolutely doesn't have to be) particularly attracts misogynists? Are movie-goers just as bad? What about fans of other things?

 

I think it affects all walks of our society.

 

Because I'm a bit of a watch geek, it took me by supprise when I first started reading a watch forum a few years ago how some dive watch fans have strong opinions that they should never be worn by Women. I pulled 1 of them up on this and got a heated reply back that girls (Never Women) aren't as strong divers so their precious, yellow gold dive watches look best and only really are made for men. Of course, diving history is filled with examples of Women divers and adventurers but that didn't trouble their bigoted little heads.

 

Another thing I've noticed as I've got more hobbies, is there's always a pissing contest for amount of knowledge one acquires or how good they are in their hobby. I've always felt the surface level competition is bullshit, it's just a way to measure your cock by saying mine's bigger than yours. Example; A week ago on Twitter, their was a tweet that blew up that was something like; You can only enjoy a game if you don't use a rewind feature. People waded in but for me, it highlighted a little quirk that if you get a load of blokes in a room, it becomes a pissing contest and that sadly, perputates out into all forms of society. Just Women rarely do the leading because Men keep them held down.

 

Despite needing to do so much more, reading that blog above made me so happy. Slowly, the basment dwelling little 4Chan fucks who get angry Women aren't portrayed in the way they want them to be (Young, tits out & subservient to Men’s wishes) are having their world torn down. :)

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Progressive values always win out in the end, it's just so fucking frustrating when they're pushed against in this manner. 

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3 hours ago, Stoppy2000 said:

Used your ban time for some important self reflection then? 

 

How's the folk allowed to post in the EU and Election threads doing? They okay?

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